
	Weekly chat # 36: Tuesday October 31st 2000
	
Participants: Peter Kretschmar, Niels Joergen Westergaard, Sami Maisala,
	Stefan Larsson, Carol Anne Oxborrow
	
Subjects discussed:
	CVS repository for ADD
	Updated jemx.h
	Deadline of ADD 5.1 contributions
	Getting background information from GRANAT
	Interactive background handling (dedicated chat, preparations)
	Data structures in RP2.0
	Improving j_ima_basic_recon
	Delivering j_ima_intens_cor
	
Action Items

001031_1	ALL	12/00 Decide what we want from interactive background
OPEN			analysis

001031_2	SM	12/00 Circulate GRANAT background information within
OPEN			SDAST when he gets it.

001031_3	ALL	8/11/00 Send corrections/feedback to CAO on the new
OPEN			jemx.h updated with RP2.0 data structures, and the
			updated ADD data dictionary.
			
001031_4	SM	8/11 Send an email to all SDAST about current and future
OPEN			plans for background handling as preparation for chat
			about interactive background handling.
			
001031_5	NJW	8/11 Circulate email about his needs/ideas for
OPEN			interactive background handling: preparation for chat

001031_6	SL	8/11 Circulate email about his needs/ideas for
OPEN			interactive background handling: preparation for chat

001031_7	ALL	9/11 To read the emails about interactive analysis
OPEN			as preparation for chat about interactive background
			handling.


**** Logging Started : Tue Oct 31 09:28:25 MET 2000
<peter> Good morning everybody - almost a crowd :-) !
<njw> Good morning Peter and Carol Anne END
> Hello Peter and NJW, how's things with you?? END
<njw> OK, thanks - trying to read through you new jemx.h END
<peter> In my case, somewhat hectic - I was away on Friday and Monday and have 
tons of emails to read, several urgent questions to resolve ... END
> I'm only just getting down to real work after the Science festival and
> our holiday in England - I was exhausted after getting home - it's taken
> me week to recover from that holiday! END
> I do hope the swedes and finns turn up for this chat. END
<peter> Me too - should we try phone calls?
> i've just r4ung stefan, he'll be with us soon end
*** larsson (~larsson@tenma.dsri.dk) has joined channel #jemxadr
<peter> Hi Stefan! END
<larsson> Hi. 
<larsson> END
<peter> CAO: Are you calling Helsinki, or should I try my luck? END
> sami can'y get through end
<peter> Arrgh, maybe we need to find another area for our chats. END
> he may have a firewall problem. which server at dsri are you other guys using?
*** smaisala (^smaisala@mizar.astro.helsinki.fi) has joined channel #jemxadr
<peter> Hi Sami - gald you made it! END
<larsson> I have logged on to tenma and is running from that. END
> Okay, so let's start with the AI: Allan already told me he'd be late.
<smaisala> Hi there. I had few problems to get through. END
> Firstly, in updating the AI list I found that many open AI pertain to the
> ADD update, so could we set a deadline for those, something like:
> 'two weeks after CAO has set up the CVS repository'? END
<larsson> Sounds reasonable. END
> The CVS repository will be set up this week - at least I'm beginning it
> now because I had to wait for our sysadmin to return from a course.
> However, beginning it this week doesn't garantee that it'll be working this
> week! Our first update using this system may well be somewhat slower than
> withour usual method, but subsequent updates should be MUCH easier. END
> Any comments? Is two weeks after repository setup okay with you guys as a
> deadline? END
<smaisala> OK END
<peter> I'll put it like this - it just has to work. It's mainly a question or 
priorities now. END
> It will work, but not maybe within a few days END
> Okay, if there's no more comments, I'll put `two weeks after CVS repository
> made available by CAO' as the deadline for all ADD-related AIs. END
> Any comments? END
<njw> N
<peter> No
<larsson> no
<smaisala> no
> Let's go through the other non-ADD AIs, then. 
> AI13.8 	SM 	11/00  	Discuss interactive version of background 
				programs 
OPEN			with Bruce O'Neil at ISDC
> So how's it going SM? END
<smaisala> I had very short conversation with Bruce. The main problem is we 
haven't decided yet what we really want with this program
> If the dialogue has been initiated, perhaps we shold close this AI, and
> make another one on various SDAST members to decide what they want? END
<peter> Fine with me. END
<smaisala> I agree that. When we have done that I can discuss more how to code 
that software. END
> Okay, consider it done. Next AI:
> AI13.15 NJW/CAO	11/00 	Find out what calibration data (products) will 
be 
OPEN			provided bythe calibration activity, and what 
			calibration data structuresare needed

> So NJW, how are we progressing here? END
<njw> Let us put it this way: the  progress is ahead of us END
> Could we set aside a morning together next week to discuss this NJW - the
> whole calibration campaign thing? What about wednesday morning of next week? 
> end
<njw> Fine with me - let's decide that END
> Okay, next wed. it is. next AI:
> AI13.17 NJW	11/00 	Ensure that the calibration document will contain 
OPEN			descriptions of data-formats, products etc. which will 
			be in telemetry format to be provided to ISDC

<njw> Same story END
> We'll cover this one too next wednesday. So next AI:
> AI14.3	SM,AH	10/00 	Contact Russian GRANAT specialists to get 
background
			information from mission

> Well SM: this one's been hanging around forever, let's take some firm steps
> to get it out of the way. I'll give Allan a bit of a push. Comments? END
<smaisala> That is under work. I just get the Granat specialist email from 
Allan.
> Great, so no push needed from me? END
<smaisala> No, I think Allan has closed his part of this AI :)
> Could we put an AI on you Sami to disseminate the information you get from
> GRANAT when you get it, and in so doing, that would close this AI? END
<smaisala> Yes. Let's close this AI and I put the new one to me. END
> Done. The  last non-ADD AI is on me to code deadtime executable - I think
> that can be moved to regular work. END
<peter> I agree
> Okay, next on the agenda: data structures. I've just sent you all the updated
> jemx.h: I REALLY need feedback on descrepancies between what we think we
> have and what ISDC thinks we use. Later today I'll be sending you all a
> first draft of the updated ADD data dictionary , also updated to reflect
> the RP2.0 templates. Again, each of us is responsible for certain data
> structures, and I need feedback for the data dictionary: obsolete DSs,
> missing DSs, incorrect contents descriptions, incorrect listing of columns.
> Can I put and AI on all of you to give me that feedback? END
<njw> Y
<peter> Yes
<larsson> Y
<smaisala> Y
> I'll put the deadline in a week, say 8/11/00 , Okay? END
<larsson> Jepp.
<peter> OK
<smaisala> ok
> Next on the agenda: outstanding V2 deliveries and V2 updates: where do we
> stand on the imaging executables NJW? END
<njw> j_ima_shadowgram has been delivered. New version with OBT selection is 
foreseen.
<njw> j_ima_basic_recon has been delivered and a new version with 
"make sky-image" included
<njw> is close to delivery (waiting for tests with RP2.0)
<njw> j_ima_src_find has been delivered but a code refinement will be 
implemented
<njw> j_ima_intens_cor is still rather sketchy but not so hard to code
<njw> END
> So we're only missing one executable from V2 now? END
<njw> Y
> How's that sit with you Peter? END
<peter> Well enough.
> What about updates, are there any you simply have to have within the next
> week, Peter? END
<peter> From ISDC's point of view it may be currently more improtant to improve j_basic_recon
<peter> than to get j_ima_intens_cor. But if the former may take a long time, it would be politically nicer to first go for the second.
<peter> What I am currently eager to get is redelivieries of the j_bkg_ and j_src_ executables. END
<njw> Yes, an improvement of j_ima_basic_recon will take some time. Also the 3C273 image is very
<njw> close to the detection limit so it showed the 'worst case' END
<larsson> j_src_lc update will be completed this week. 
<larsson> But no testing with RP2 yet.
> Could we put an AI on SL and SM to get those critical updates in by the
<larsson> src_spectra is another 2 weeks off.
<larsson> END
> end of the week, or the end of next week? END
<smaisala> I can redeliver my stuff immediately when all my data structures are
 accepted in ISDC. END
<peter> Regarding j_ima_basic_recon: The problem is not so much, that 3C273 is 
hard to see, but rather that we have these very systematic and large background 
structures in the reconstructed images.
<peter> Roland showed a simulation of a Galactic Plane Scan mosaiced together 
last Thursday and those structures make it really hard to visually spot the 
sources.
<peter> But we understand that this is not a trivial change. So maybe it's best 
if we first get j_ima_intens_cor. 
> I think we have to decide which we're going to go with first, here and
<peter> But after that, ISDC's priority would be on an improvement of 
j_ima_basic_recon. It would be really nice if we got it
> now. END
<peter> for the public OSim release planned for early January. END
<peter> To Sami: good to hear that - thanks. Please make sure to specify the 
need for new templates in your delivery notes. END
> Shall we make improvement of _basic_recon our official priority? END
<njw> Alright, Peter, I hear what you say, and I'll try to come up with a 
solution in the
<njw> coming two months. END
<peter> OK, so the conclusion is: j_ima_intens_cor first (should not take long),
 and then j_ima_basic_recon upadate. Do all agree? END
> Yes, that seems best. END
<njw> Y
> Okay, next on the agenda: V3 coding? How's this coming along guys? Any DD
> done yet? END
> Any comments about V3 Peter? END
<njw> Not much END
<peter> No real comments from my side. I have an outstanding action on the 
interactive background stuff and _should_ spend
<peter> some time thinking about the whole picture. But time for this is very 
scarce indeed. END
> We all need to think about this, especially the image and source people
> ie. NJW and SL, who are really affected by the state of the background
> determination. Any comments? END
<njw> This will probably come naturally when thinking about removing the 
systematic
<njw> structures in the reconstructed image END
> Do we maybe need a chat devoted to the subject of interactive background
> analysis to get our ideas straight? END
<njw> Maybe even a meeting (?) END
> yes, that might be the solution, because we do seem to keep coming up
> against this wall END
> A chat, a meeting, what will it be chaps? END
<larsson> I agree that a meeting is better. END
<peter> The main problem with having a meeting is finding the time. Would we 
want a meeting before January? 
<peter> And if yes - where?
<peter> END
> Could we maybe start with a chat within the next couple of weeks, and see
> what comes out of it? END
<peter> Fine with me. But it should be prepared, i.e. all involved should have 
spent some time thinking about this issue first. END
> Okay, when: what about the morning of Thurs. 9th, or Fri 10th at 9.30am ? END
<larsson> Also prepare with some written comments on the status. END
<njw> We can at least do that. Personally I would like to have a presentation 
of the Helsinki
<njw> background handling and of Stefans spectrum/lc extractions. END
> Okay, that's an AI on Sami to circulate an eamil to all of SDAST about:
> 1) current background handling (non-interactive)
> 2) His current ideas about interactive BKG handling
> Another AI on to circulate an email to all of SDAST about his source-
> processing needs where BKG is concerned. That and AI on SL. 
> Another AI on NJW to circulate an email about his BKG handling requirements
> for image processing.
> Is that in order for preparation for such a chat? END
<njw> That's OK END
<larsson> Yes, I think so. END
<smaisala> OK END
<njw> Could we set the chat time to Thursday morning ? (Nov. 9) END
> That's fine with me. END
> What about the rest of you? END
<larsson> Looks fine for me. END
<peter> OK
> Sami? END
<smaisala> That's fine END
> Okay so the time for the chat on interactive background analysis is
> 9.30 Danish Galactic Time, on Thursday 9th November 2000. Everyone got
> that? END
<njw> In my calendar END
<smaisala> Yep. END
<peter> Yes. END
<larsson> Yes. END
> last on the agenda: ADD5.1. As stated above the repository will be
> available this week or next at latest, after which you have 2 weeks to
> complete your revisions, so we should have our next version out by
> Christmas 2000. The repository will allow you to check files in and out
> over the email, which will make it all a lot  easier than it is at the
> moment. Any questions? END
<peter> No, sounds good - except that I will actually need to work on this :-) 
END
> We all will: lots has changed and firmed up since last we took a dip in the
> ADD pool END
> Now for AOB: I have a major confession: I think I've overlooked the AIs from
> our meeting in Geneva, these probably got overlooked during the Science
> Festival, so I'll update the AI list with those AIs and circulate the
> consolidated list after this chat. END
> We WILL have another general chat next week in addition to the BKG chat,
> it will be at 9.30 on Tuesday morning, and I'll send the agenda to you
> all next monday. Any comments? AOB? END
<smaisala> No
<peter> No
<njw> N
<larsson> n
> Okay, chat with you next week. Have a good week, and an even better
> weekend! END
